Source code

All projects that somehow make usage of code.
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xarn
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Source code

Post by xarn » Mon Dec 05, 2011 18:35

Knitter
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Re: Source code

Post by Knitter » Mon Dec 05, 2011 19:59

I would suggest a proper license agreement since I, at least, can't use that code with the "license" you chose, and neither is anyone in my country able to legally use it :)
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xarn
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Re: Source code

Post by xarn » Tue Dec 06, 2011 13:23

Huh? Why? The beerware license: "do whaterver you want with it" seems fairly clear to me that anyone can use it.

...but OK, I'll put it as (simplified) BSD license if you prefer.
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Re: Source code

Post by Knitter » Tue Dec 06, 2011 15:07

Simply because it's not a legally accepted license, it's not a license at all. In Portugal an author needs to explicitly, using a legally accepted document, grant his permission or else the work and any use of it will be governed by, in this case, computer software laws. These laws actually prevent most of the uses and place anyone using the work in a dubious situation. A license agreement is a valid contract that allows authors the offer their works by their own rules instead of relying only on the existing laws.

Laws are not the same everywhere and I'm bound to those in my country :)
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xarn
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Re: Source code

Post by xarn » Tue Dec 06, 2011 16:32

Aha ...surprising ...so you can't have custom licenses except if you have the consent of the state?! ...wow. ...and if there is some "rules" written by the owner, it's ignored in favor of copyright law? Crazy Portugal! :p
...well, at least you don't suffer from license propagation.
Anyway, now it's BSD and you can use it in Portugal! :P
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xarn
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Re: Source code

Post by xarn » Tue Dec 06, 2011 16:43

Just for the joy of completeness:

Beerware is a quite "tongue in cheek" license which kind of rebels against the over complexification of licenses. However, it may be interesting to note that this license is used in many existing software and already covers millions of source code lines, for instance in FreeBSD also.

As for the OSI approval, it was sent for approval but the process seems to be pending in the air since ages.

However, you can find other simple licenses like the "fair license" which are OSI approved:

<Copyright Information>

Usage of the works is permitted provided that this instrument is retained with the works, so that any entity that uses the works is notified of this instrument.

DISCLAIMER: THE WORKS ARE WITHOUT WARRANTY.


...which is even simplier than the beerware license ...but less funny. :P
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Re: Source code

Post by Knitter » Tue Dec 06, 2011 17:06

xarn wrote:Aha ...surprising ...so you can't have custom licenses except if you have the consent of the state?!

Of course you can have custom licenses, but they need to be legally accepted. A license is nothing more than a contract, and like all contracts needs to be clear and can't conflict with the country's laws, in this case, you are trying to give users permissions that the law doesn't, so you contract needs to be clear and needs to be considered valid.

xarn wrote: ...wow. ...and if there is some "rules" written by the owner, it's ignored in favor of copyright law?

I didn't say that, I said that the rules need to be legally accepted, and this is valid everywhere, even when written down by USA lawyers some license agreements haven't been proven in USA courts, how would you expect that some simple text written in a very simple and broad way can be accepted in a country that has different laws, culture and concepts?

xarn wrote:Crazy Portugal! :p

We have our moments :D

But even big EULAs have problems here (and in many European countries), e.g.: almost every EULA I've seen prohibits me from reverse engineering the software and from making copies of the software, but these two things are safeguarded by Portuguese laws, meaning I can, legally, make copies of MS Windows, or MS Office and I can, completely legally, reverse engineer MS Windows, no matter how much Microsoft screams :D. If these documents, that have been made by countless lawyers, have problems when they are applied to a given country, it's only natural that a simple text with no much legal backing has more problems ;)
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Re: Source code

Post by snowdrop » Tue Dec 06, 2011 19:02

EULA I've seen prohibits me from reverse engineering the software and from making copies of the software, but these two things are safeguarded by Portuguese laws, meaning I can, legally, make copies of MS Windows, or MS Office and I can, completely legally, reverse engineer MS Windows, no matter how much Microsoft screams :D. If these documents,


That's some amazing stuff with even more amazing implications:

How come it isn't done then? Why don't all just place their servers in Portu and start hacking/cracking away? Or move there if necessary. I guess it would even be enough to just stay there for the duration of the (reverse)coding.

It also sounds like the EU will change all of that eventually due to the will of the White House...
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Re: Source code

Post by Knitter » Tue Dec 06, 2011 19:24

snowdrop wrote:How come it isn't done then? Why don't all just place their servers in Portu and start hacking/cracking away?

Because there are several laws associated with it, some rules to what can and can't be done, and because having the servers here is no enough, e.g.: though I have servers in the USA I'm still under Portuguese law, and not the USA, since I operate in Portugal and I have no commercial relations in the USA, no residence or any contact with the USA, and I fall under a special category that excludes me from most USA laws. Laws apply not only where you have your servers but also where you live, in most cases you have to respect both :)

Reverse engineering is something that a) is not easy to do, b) serves only a small set of purposes, c) would result in something that could only be used here or in other countries that had the same laws and respected ours rights in a similar way.

And as per making copies, I can make as many has I want, and I can even break copyright restriction software, but I can never distribute, in any way, the copies I make. They need to be exclusively for backup purposes.

My all point with these small examples is to make clear that there is a lot to take into consideration when talking about licenses and the use of someone else's work and that we need to think a bit about what we choose. Someone may offer me a piece of code but I may very well be prevented from using it due to some laws in my country, and this is true for everyone.
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xarn
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Re: Source code

Post by xarn » Sun Jan 17, 2016 20:15

Oh man... that's all pretty long ago.

But this was actually a working prototype, where you could play against someone else. ...well, kind of. Like draw cards from a premade deck into your hand, place them on the table, flip them, and that's about it if I remember right. Of course it was interactive with the opponent too.

But still, it's a start. Anyone interested that I revive this?
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