Recolouring Template: Red Banner

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Mattaiyah
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Re: Recolouring Template: Red Banner

Post by Mattaiyah » Thu Apr 26, 2012 20:59

Well, I had more time to work on this, so here's the latest version : http://i.imgur.com/sSroM.jpg

A note for anyone working on this : Install Liberation Serif. It's the font used for the card.

Here's a list of changes from my previous version :
  • Made the colour of the gradiants above the map more red.
  • Added more details to the silver bars on the side of the map.
  • Installed Liberation Serif.
  • Added a picture.
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Re: Recolouring Template: Red Banner

Post by snowdrop » Sat Apr 28, 2012 08:04

Q_x wrote:TBH, I think that there's nothing decided literally, as long as there is someone working, all can be changed. Knowing that before, I'd prepare exploded creature template as well.
Something needs to differ between the various factions creature templates. Card art, will, but that isn't enough and doesn't always reveal faction belonging.

They will have different logos, and that could be enough, but if so, how come they all share the green-ish framing, which is identical with the gaian event-card framing? Answer is I imagined that each faction would have a "framing" colour of it's own. In the gaian case it's greenish. Rest of the template colouring playes nicely with it, for example the yellow details/lines in the framing, and the yellowish background of the gain event template (included in the #1 post in this thread).

The brownish in the gaian creature template is "gaian" because it works aesthetically and also brings thought to (mother) earth.

Due to it mostly being aesthetically, I am not keen on rationalizing the framing colour choices beyond the extent that green is usually associated with nature and red banner well, maybe red, given name and socialist nature, blue for nobles (again, political colouring) and most likley something purplish för empire (historiacally a royal colour). What each framing colour would work with when it comes to the background colour for the creature templte and/or event template would probably more or less "follow" from how colours look and interact together.
If creature template isn't universal really, why not make gaian cards look more gaian? Isn't it too brown? I'd say the current template may suit other faction more, like Empire - that is if we keep imperial as it was so far.
What would be more gaian? (Don't say blue, it won't play nice, also we have merfolk that will look shit on it) I'm not against using that specific gaian brown for another faction, I just don't see it work well with purplish framing of we make Empire purple, and am not sure about the alternative. Instead of touching gaia I think we can achieve new template colour schemes on their own.



Edit:

Mattaiyah

1. Fonts used for card text should be "Liberation Serif", except for the mockup warning in footer, which uses "Liberation Sans" and gold-cost (+ the attack/defense value on the creature card) which uses "Nimbus Roman No9 L".

2. Kill the gaian logo (leaf) and the threshold marker (other green small object at the side) when exporting your suggestions, I think they ruin the overall impression and disturb with their green =P Also feel free to create mock-up logo for red banner, we still don't have a proper one yet ( http://wtactics.org/wiki/index.php?titl ... tion_Logos )


3. There are still green/goldy details in http://i.imgur.com/OhZVa.jpg next to the silverish framing stuff, it's on the base of the shadowing.

4. Check out the attachment "gaian title":
gaiantitle.png
Gaian Title, from event card template
The darkest green is the background. The brightest green is framing, alongside with gold. That's 2 relted base colours (greens) and one alternative for framing detail.

In your case the alternative is silverish/gray, and that seems to work well with the overall redish theme. What is off in your suggestion is the relation between the reds, which is inverted: You're using the bright one as backgroudn and dark one as detail. Maybe that isn't a bad thing, and it's probably not necessary for us to be coherent, but it could explain what feels off (or is it a bad thing is it isn't coherent, what do you think Qx? Personally I like coherency, but I'm not sure I can give good arguments for it in these cases...)

5. Maybe somewhat darker/deeper red would work better... hrm.. hard to say... it is still the best red suggestion this far. Red seems to be really really hard to create something decent with.... :(


qx
003.png
q_x take on rad banner recolouring, event card title
I like that, a lot, although I'd want to see the rest of the template being in the same colouring, just as the gaian is, instead of being the bleached out greens you used. If we give up on real red I think this could be it. Would maybe have to change the gold though to some other nuance. The brownish bg is close to what surrounds the forum, but warmer.
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Re: Recolouring Template: Red Banner

Post by Mattaiyah » Sat Apr 28, 2012 16:02

New version with a few edits and a new banner : http://i.imgur.com/SFuGb.jpg and http://i.imgur.com/dZkaw.jpg

EDIT : Newer version with a diffrent version of the banner : http://i.imgur.com/r7ZCU.jpg
snowdrop wrote:1. Fonts used for card text should be "Liberation Serif", except for the mockup warning in footer, which uses "Liberation Sans" and gold-cost (+ the attack/defense value on the creature card) which uses "Nimbus Roman No9 L".
snowdrop wrote:5. Maybe somewhat darker/deeper red would work better... hrm.. hard to say... it is still the best red suggestion this far. Red seems to be really really hard to create something decent with....
Well, it's a good thing I'm an idiot and installed Liberation Sans with the previous version. However, Inkscape tells me that the mockup warning uses Liberation Serif, not Liberation Sans. Nimbus Roman No9 L is also completly impossible to find. I did end up changing the colour with previous version, but it seems you missed it. (http://i.imgur.com/sSroM.jpg)
snowdrop wrote:3. There are still green/goldy details in http://i.imgur.com/OhZVa.jpg next to the silverish framing stuff, it's on the base of the shadowing.
I thought I had already done all of those! Thanks for pointing it out.
snowdrop wrote:4. Check out the attachment "gaian title":
The darkest green is the background. The brightest green is framing, alongside with gold. That's 2 relted base colours (greens) and one alternative for framing detail.
I fixed it to be more in line with the gaian title.
snowdrop wrote:2. Kill the gaian logo (leaf) and the threshold marker (other green small object at the side) when exporting your suggestions, I think they ruin the overall impression and disturb with their green =P Also feel free to create mock-up logo for red banner, we still don't have a proper one yet (http://wtactics.org/wiki/index.php?titl ... tion_Logos)
Well, don't mind if I do!

I'm not going to claim to do a good job with the banner, but for a temporary banner, it should work fine.
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Re: Recolouring Template: Red Banner

Post by snowdrop » Sun Apr 29, 2012 19:11

fonts: You can find the ones we use at our ftp >>> http://wtactics.org/downloads/ ...they're in /fonts

You can also fetch alternate banner artwork from /unused artwork/BfW/portraits/orcs on the same ftp.

Latest starts to look like something =) Think Q_x will come with some input on it. I myself think it's just a matter of tweaking from here on if we're going for red, which was the original idea, but would want his word on this as he's the arty one and has a way better eye for this than I do + knows print. What comes to mind directly is the bright red lines in the title, they "convert" poorly from the gaian version.. hrm...

Banner logo is excellent as tenp holder, and maybe it could even be iterated into what will become the real one for them... one of us have given it a shot yet(?) and you're welcome to if you feel like it. What I think we imagine is that it is more "organic" and "torn", that it feels more like something that has been (re)used and seen a lot of struggle.. textile or whatever instead of strict steel.

My only reservation this far is that the silver/gray makes me think about steel, while I see the orcs as more of masses gathering what they find and creating stuff from rusted and crappy hardware + tree spears etc, more tribal, which suggests that Q_x is maybe closer to them with his tones. That said, red and silverish looks quite nice and should probably be kept, and it could also be considered to be rock/mountain instead... hrm....
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Re: Recolouring Template: Red Banner

Post by Mattaiyah » Sun Apr 29, 2012 23:17

snowdrop wrote:fonts: You can find the ones we use at our ftp >>> http://wtactics.org/downloads/ ...they're in /fonts
Well, they are there, it's just that they don't really work.

The problem is the font name for those files are NimbusRomNo9L, when it should be Nimbus Roman No9 L. I could just change the name on my Inkscape files, but then there may be problems if I need to send the Inkcape files.

So of course the obvious solution is to edit the files! Good thing that really easy and not something I should have to spend hours on! :x

Here are the edited files, if someone wants them :
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B-0EDi ... S1LN2xBTFk
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B-0EDi ... DBLbi1rT1E

The big problem with the bright red lines is the way that they look at the end.

About the banner, I always though that it would look like the orcs had taken someone's cape and made it their banner.

I'm working on a new version of the banner which looks more like a cape.

New version here : http://i.imgur.com/grorJ.jpg

Changes in this version :
  • Attempt at fixing the bright red lines.
  • Slight changes in the gray borders, one segment is darker.
  • Installed Nimbus Roman No9 L.
I hate whoever made it so hard to edit .ttf files.
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Re: Recolouring Template: Red Banner

Post by Q_x » Mon Apr 30, 2012 05:36

Problems with the font will stay with us for a longer while, I guess. There are two fonts out there, similarly named, and one of us used to have both installed at once, confusing his system. Not going into details - simply worry not, change what you need. The font looks identical - or identical enough - to be used one in place of another in template design. I'm not sure how to prevent errors like that from happening, confusion started with font management issue in Ubuntu - I believe it was still 10.somenthing, so maybe it's better now. Renaming the font may cause other docs on your system, or other systems, to crash in the same way.

This problems are 100% sorted out in the next step of card "production" - that is Scribus. And there is not much of a difference in how those fonts look, it's compatibility for the sake of compatibility.

Overall look of your template is still a bit vampiric (though I like it), RB is all about community, hard work, simple life and egalitarianism.
I quite liked the earlier (bit more torn) your version of the logo, and it was the best RB logo attempt so far IMO.

If you stick to gray inner frame - as it is now - maybe the map in same shade will look OK? I know there's brown stuff underneath it, so it's easier said, than done...
When writing about warm gray, I had in mind clay-like or dirt-like tones, pink background is really awkward idea - at leas for me. Take a look at the images (you have to download it):
http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~wtdevs/wta ... sed%20orc/
http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~wtdevs/wta ... 0Gatherer/
http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~wtdevs/wta ... 20Drummer/
and you'll get what I mean. This is RB palette in action. It's not necessary to use the exact same palette on the images and frame, it just have to feel good one with another - in the sense that card template is a display case for the artwork (text still has to be readable) - should be quiet, slick, elegant, appealing, and pretty much as light, as possible. It's not an easy task, framing the cards, and the standards are really high - higher, than I can reach easily. But it's not just art for art, it's really, really important, as it impacts user experience strongly, and should not interfere with any other elements, but rather help it blend all together.

I'll correct all that I can (and do what I've promised) as soon, as I get back home, and have my mouse (and headphones!) back.
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Re: Recolouring Template: Red Banner

Post by snowdrop » Mon Apr 30, 2012 08:14

Also, feel free to experiment with title and card type font colours - the yellow that's currently used was chosen because it matched the gaian template. Obviously it kind of looks out of place now.
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Re: Recolouring Template: Red Banner

Post by Mattaiyah » Mon Apr 30, 2012 18:15

About the whole font nonsense, I don't think I'll have any problems since I didn't have any version of it installed before this point. Also, since this has come up, I don't use Ubuntu, I use Windows. Just something to keep in mind.

The thing about the torn banner was that it was only added for one picture. I didn't save the version with the torn one, so it went back to not torn version. I did save the torn one in a diffrent file though, so it will now be in every verion starting from now.

Speaking of :
New version here : http://i.imgur.com/JL1N1.jpg

Change in this version :
  • Torn elements in banner are deeper.
  • Silver border around banner has been improved.
  • Changed to more dirt-like colours.
There was enough talk about a more dirt-like colour to make me do one. I'll still go back to red if I need to.

This new version was made from the original, so if I forgot to change something, please tell me.
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Re: Recolouring Template: Red Banner

Post by Mattaiyah » Sat May 05, 2012 02:26

I found some time to change some of the things that were bothering me in the previous version.

New version here : http://i.imgur.com/KUbtX.jpg

Changes in this version :
  • Vampiric elements in the top of the background are removed
  • Banner is now torn instead of just eaten by moths or something
  • Font changed to gray
I am not even going to delude myself in beliving that I did a good job with the font colour.

Edit : I forgot to change the font colour for the number in the banner, but that's been fixed. Also the font is less dark.
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Re: Recolouring Template: Red Banner

Post by Q_x » Thu May 10, 2012 08:06

Me again. I'm terribly sorry for replying you that late. I hope you're still with us.
Whole hell broke loose from under my life's carpet. And it's as far from quiet, as life can be. Just to justify myself.

I like the card a lot as it is now. It's smooth and tasty. Nothing I'd say that must be changed really.
I'm not sure if it's god for Red Banner or some other faction.
But maybe for RB. I can see this vibrant rusty red sticking out really well in that frame.
If the frame needs any changes - it's start from scratch, or some really minor tweaking.

I'm not quite convinced about the logo. The shape suits the feel of how logo should be like pretty well - slick and smooth - same as with gaian leaf and Shadow liver (I know this will change though, even if I like the liver idea for extra craziness and necromantic factor - I'd like a heart even more). The colours could be a bit more defined, heavier, vibrant and more juicy. Not a lot, just a bit.

One more time - I'm sorry it took me so long.
And thumbs up for your work, congrats for your talent.

Cheers!
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