Red Banner - our nearest future

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Q_x
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Red Banner - our nearest future

Post by Q_x » Mon Dec 13, 2010 20:37

Gaians are pretty much rolling, Snowdrop made some steps towards Red Banner to get cooking too.
Take a look at the story here:
http://chaosrealm.net/wtactics/wiki/ind ... Red_Banner

So - how do you imagine this faction?

I see it that way, let the creatures go first:
Strong, aggressive Orcs
Weak, cheap Goblins, maybe even free unit that can be played as a companion to any Orc

Equipment:
Improvised, ineficient stuff, dull, rusty, neglected, cheap.
Simple war machines.

Spells and Enchantments:
Primitive magic
Tweaking with creature's morale and will to fight
emphasize "mass" or "company" gives "power"

Events:
focus on helping with playing creatures (like drawing more cards from the deck than other players can do) and also things that Spells are hooked onto.

Strategy:
Goblins are sacrificed to help orcs defeat even strongest enemies.
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Re: Red Banner - our nearest future

Post by pennomi » Tue Dec 14, 2010 00:38

Wow, I really like the background story of the Red Banner!

I imagine it containing the cheapest, mostly basic units with weaker powers but lots of them. Goblins, Orcs, and probably a few units from all races. It will contain the widest diversity of races. Possible unit names: Elvish Exile, Child Thief, Assassin, Orcish Grunt, Goblin Pillager, Dwarvish Laborer, Prison Escapee, Fugitive.

Since they lack a lot of heavy hitting units, abilities focus on gaining bonuses in numbers. Imagine abilities like these:

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Flank: If there is at least one other creature with Flank in the front, this unit gets +1/0.

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Hoard: When you attack, all attacking units with Hoard are counted as one large unit of power X/X, where X is the number of units in the Hoard.
(Note: they would still be separate units as far as defending.)

This would mostly be useful for extremely weak creatures (like 0/1).

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This unit's cost is reduced by 1 if you have at least one Orc in play.
Maybe there would be events along the lines of this:

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If you have more attacking units than your opponent has units in the front, your units can't be blocked this turn.
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Re: Red Banner - our nearest future

Post by snowdrop » Tue Dec 14, 2010 18:38

Q_x wrote: So - how do you imagine this faction?
/../
Strong, aggressive Orcs
Weak, cheap Goblins, maybe even free unit that can be played as a companion to any Orc
Image

Above is one of my favourite MtG cards ever. Wouldn't mind if we had something similar called "minor commander" :P

I share your vision of weak cheap masses of goblins and stronger orcs. I also rather see we invest in more and new goblins further along the road, as I think they should be in much larger numbers than orcs. At the very least a ratio of 1:3 in the end. And thats also excluding other species and just the orc-gonlin relation.
Equipment:
Improvised, ineficient stuff, dull, rusty, neglected, cheap.
Agreed. They are heavy on equipment, but most of it is thrashy and as you describe it. HIgher tier units do have good equipment skills on occasion though.
Simple war machines.
What are they? How do they work? Are they like my suggested Mounts in the end of the ORC? Or something very different?

I have a fantasy of introducing something that is along the lines of war machines in a steam driven or magic driven shape into WT in a future expansion geared towards that kind of stuff but I'm not sure how they should be designed since I would still want them to be very rare, making it a bad idea to create a new card type just for that reason, while we very well could/should use a subtype instead.
Spells and Enchantments:
Primitive magic
Yes, very little, and very pirmitive. They're not a magic heavy faction. And what little magic there is is about aggression.
Tweaking with creature's morale and will to fight
Dunno, I think more of HoN for that, as they "bribe" and sabotage and it all evolves around trickery. RB doesnt trick, they attack. Always forward, seldom retreating. Ready to die for the cause.

RB could have some skills though that weaken enemy when there are many RB:s amassed on table...plays well with pennomis suggestion as well.

emphasize "mass" or "company" gives "power"
Yups. Very few superstrong creatures (but the do exist, they just lack finesse)
Events:
focus on helping with playing creatures (like drawing more cards from the deck than other players can do)
Could be.
and also things that Spells are hooked onto.
I don't follow that one. = P
Strategy:
Goblins are sacrificed to help orcs defeat even strongest enemies.
Commander! :P

Pennomi: Could use most of what you suggested. Dwarfs will be sparse in RB though, but sure, eventually we should drop some in there as well, after all, every dwarf can't be a winner ;) Initially it will mainly be orc, goblin and humans in RB...and undead will probably not be part of it either ;)
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Re: Red Banner - our nearest future

Post by TorbenBeta » Wed Dec 15, 2010 17:12

To go back to the mtg-card. How about creating a system of synergy inside the Banner?
I mean something like this: A goblin sub commander is played. You can play x goblin tokens. This would work well with the intended focus on amassing/horde. If an Orc commander/ tribal leader (I don't know about the tribal aspect of orc culture and if we would want to put emphases on the tribal or "civilised" way) is played the goblins get exemplary +1/0 or could be sacrificed to booster the strength of the faith into the cause...
But why must orcs be so archetypical? Is it to show that revolutionaries are poor and don't have good equipment?
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Re: Red Banner - our nearest future

Post by snowdrop » Wed Dec 15, 2010 21:07

But why must orcs be so archetypical? Is it to show that revolutionaries are poor and don't have good equipment?
Well, being poor kind of constitutes one good reason to actually become a revolutionary - you have nothing to lose and all to gain. Havng rusty weapons is really more of a flavour and visual aspect than logical in game terms, and yes, I guess if they are poor it would look strange if we armed them with diamond swords ;)

Orcs aren't that stereotypical - they tried to live a more urban way of life but they got crapped on by the others, eventually forcing them back to a state where they fight again, but now also with an idea - one of equality.
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Re: Red Banner - our nearest future

Post by Ravenchild » Wed Dec 15, 2010 21:45

To be honest: I think the background story needs some improvements in style. I'm not totally awake now but I found it confusing to read.

While the people of the red banner have a very good sense for justice and brotherhood, I suggest that this faction is heavily influenced by epic units who improve morale of the troops.
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Re: Red Banner - our nearest future

Post by TorbenBeta » Thu Dec 16, 2010 17:11

You mean like the leadership ability of Elvish Captain?
I thought about something like this too, but I found that it is more suited to the hierarchical structure of the Empire.
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Re: Red Banner - our nearest future

Post by Q_x » Fri Dec 17, 2010 10:45

Thumbs up for "epic" orc heroes!
Will weak and small goblins occupy slots on fronts?
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Re: Red Banner - our nearest future

Post by Ravenchild » Fri Dec 17, 2010 13:44

TorbenBeta wrote:You mean like the leadership ability of Elvish Captain?
Yes, but with a great variety of boost-abilities for each epic unit.
I thought about something like this too, but I found that it is more suited to the hierarchical structure of the Empire.
I don't know what the empire will be like, but I'd like to see an orkish faction that does not only consist of dumb fighters but also of units of honor, morale and justice.
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Re: Red Banner - our nearest future

Post by pennomi » Sat Dec 18, 2010 00:40

Ravenchild wrote: I don't know what the empire will be like, but I'd like to see an orkish faction that does not only consist of dumb fighters but also of units of honor, morale and justice.
I'd agree with that. I'd like to see each faction as not necessarily good nor evil (with the probable exception of Undead), but all just struggling to establish their differing ideals. The Red Banner, though filled with Orcs and criminals isn't morally evil. Individual units may be good or evil, but the organization itself is filled with justice and honor as well as treachery and ruthlessness. The same principle applies to the Empire, while most creatures might view it as evil, the members of the Empire aren't evil themselves.

Basically, I want each faction to be able to be played and perceived as if it were good or evil.
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